My visit to Defkalion Canada

On February 22 I made my way to the Canadian office of Defkalion. This is a report of my experience and what I learned.

1140 Homer St. in Vancouver is an older building in a well established area of the city. Defkalion is on the second floor. The hallway is dark, but when you enter the Defkalion suite it is bright and pleasant. I was greeted by the receptionist with the classic “you need an appointment” type greeting. I introduced myself as an out of town author of Nickelpower, and as a software engineer with resume in hand. At that point Mr. Symeon Tsalikoglou greeted me, overriding the protectiveness of the receptionist.

Symeon (I’d call him Mr. Tsalikoglou except my English-bound language skills finds it difficult to deal with.) sat with me, wanted to learn where I was coming from, and only then got serious about sharing Defkalion as he knows it.

Symeon is the head of business development for the company. He has been with Defkalion since its very early days. That said, I asked him for a brief history of Defkalion’s early days. He said:

Mr. Andrea Rossi was seeking financing and a marketing channel for his technology. With a Greek friend of his, Professor Stremmenos, they travelled to Greece and met with the Greek Prime Minister for official support. The result of that meeting was an unofficial introduction to Mr. Alexandros Xanthoulis who decided to look more closely into what Mr. Rossi had to offer. Following a number of meetings in Bologna, Mr. Xanthoulis decided to sign a contract with Mr. Rossi. Defkalion was created to commercialize the black box technology Rossi claimed he had on a global scale, excluding the United States of America and all military applications. Defkalion worked on engineering designs and business development as early as 2010. The relationship between the two sides broke down in August 2011 because of a lack of common understanding on contractual obligations. CEO, Alexandros Xanthoulis, gathered his team at that point and asked for a show of hands on what should happen to the company now that there was no more Rossi, hence no more technology, hence nothing to move forward with. Symeon, who was present during that meeting, told me that everyone cast their vote on imminent closure since we had nothing except John Hadjichristos, the CTO of Defkalion and chief scientist behind today’s accomplishments. Hadjichristos asked for six months support and claimed confidence above 90%. By November of 2011, well before the six months were over, Hadjichristos had visible signs of an LENR reaction.

At that point Defkalion assembled a team of scientists and asked them to figure out LENR. They responded by studying everything that had been published on the topic, which actually is quite a lot as anyone who has looked into will attest to. This study allowed Defkalion to understand what not to do since everything to date has failed. over time, Defkalion has come to announce and show that they are actually able to tame the LENR beast for themselves. The growth and development of Defkalion was thus able to take off and leave Mr. Rossi to do follow his own work. At this point, Symeon would say that Mr. Rossi is respected but has nothing to do with Defkalion. He informs me that the company’s position is that they wish Mr. Rossi, and all other scientists in the field, success.

The next thing that I learned (I don’t know how this slipped past me and it won’t surprise me if posters point out that I wrote about it) was that Forbes magazine published an excellent article on Defkalion. The Forbes Document primarily reports on the findings of Dr. Nelson. As Mark Gibbs published in Forbes: “Michael A. Nelson, [is] a NASA employee of some thirty years standing. I contacted Mr. Nelson and found out that he was not attending the test as a representative of NASA but rather on behalf of the New Energy Foundation.

Mr. Gibbs’ bottom line is that a real scientist has had excellent and extensive access to Defkalion’s technology, and he finds it compelling! (Note that Eng. Rossi has allowed real scientists to look at his technology, but their level of access has been far too limited and controlled to become compelling.)

Now, there also was discussion about a certain report in a Greek newspaper. This report has caused Defkalion some amount of grief, especially the statement, “For every dollar you spend as a company in Canada, the provincial government of British Columbia will put other three.” (Google translation). To help people understand what has been said here, British Columbia (BC) is a province within Canada. The best analogy is that it is like a state with the United States. It has its own budget, and its own taxation. The BC government doesn’t seem to be pleased that they are reported as spending R&D money that they did not spend. (Especially, of course, when mainstream scientists are pronouncing without examination that LENR is hooey.)

I was not able to confirm any source of government support. However, the Canadian government has a very impressive program called the Scientific Research and Experimental Development program (SR&ED, referred to as “shred”). This program is impressive, I have used it myself. Its focus is very narrow to research and experimental development. (By experimental, the government means that it is something that has not been done before, and that might end up not working.) This program is great in that it is not micromanaged by the government. Their view is that if risk is being taken, and if the people doing the work are qualified, then they are prepared to participate in the risk. IE, it’s a great match for Defkalion.

A few notes:

  • · Only the R&D portion of expenditures can be applied to the SR&ED program. It doesn’t cover the light bill, the secretaries, the business department etc.
  • · The funding formula is complex, the 3 to 1 is the maximum theoretical amount. However the return is not nearly as lucrative in most R&D situations.
  • · It is a tax credit, not a grant.

I learned that there is another R&D pursuit that Defkalion is taking on. They are building a real-time mass spectrometer. It is their expectation that this device will be able to analyze the isotope mix within the reactor core in real time. This should provide incite into exactly what is going on in the LENR reaction.

Vancouver does offer Defkalion a lot of advantages, one of which is the SR&ED program. Further, the Canadian government has recognized that the LENR reaction is not a classic nuclear reaction, so it does not need to comply with the safety regulations developed for classic nuclear reactions. CSA (The Canadian Standards Association) is just down the street, and has rights to certify safety even for the US market. And, of course, Canada’s economy is not at the epicenter of all of the trouble.

Speaking to the head of business development, I surely learned about Defkalion’s business strategy. We all seem to know that Defkalion is selling the exclusive right to manufacture and market the Hyperion reactor (their intended 5 – 45kW reactor) to a region (country or group of countries.)

However, they are placing emphasis on a second marketing strategy, a strategy that I find more interesting. They are developing technical/business relationships with existing companies to develop custom LENR devices for the company’s needs. These relationships involve a relationship between the company’s technologists and Defkalion’s technologists. Symeon refers to this as a “common R&D project”.

Consider a company wants to produce an LENR car, for instance (just hopin’), their engineers would work with Defkalion’s engineers to create the ideal LENR device for that application. The company that is making the car would then set up manufacture of the LENR device. Other technologies that Symeon mentioned include ship propulsion and agriculture.

The other corporate relationship would be one who needs a custom LENR solution for an in-house problem. If a company, for instance, has many buildings which all need heat, they may work with Defkalion to engineer the ideal LENR engine. The company needing the LENR device would then arrange for its manufacture.

In closing, there clearly is an actively staffed Defkalion office at 1140 Homer St. (I was able to confirm at least 4 employees at that location.) Symeon is willing to sit down with the likes of me, and share about the company. I saw no evidence that R&D is happening at that location. My time with Defkalion was educational.

Symeon told me that some time in the near future they will be putting on demonstrations and testing opportunities for select corporations, governments, etc. At some point they will be inviting the press. He has promised me that when they begin to invite the general press, I will be invited to attend as well. I do want to be the first on my block to lay eyes on a working LENR device.

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69 Responses to “My visit to Defkalion Canada”

  1. Says:

    Thanks Bruce, this was great. Nothing beats hearing from someone who had the initiative to go there and talk in person.
    Their strategy business wise makes sound business sense. They learn from their customers about the various usages and key needs, that is very smart long term.
    A very interesting comment on CSA’s ability to approve products for the US market. This could sure do a nice end run on those trying to appose LENR going mainstream. Defkalion could beat Rossi to market, if he has the goods, through this path.

  2. Iggy Dalrymple Says:

    Good job, Bruce!

  3. Bernie Koppenhofer Says:

    Thanks for the article. I was wondering if you ask about the legal situation between Defkalion and Rossi? The quote from Mr. Xanthoulis below bothers me a great deal. The quote from the 11/29/2011 article in Ny Teknik written by Mats Lewan. The article quotes Alexandros Xanthoulis, President of Defkalion:

    “- Let’s say I have Rossi’s formula, but I do not say it officially. My scientists have found a way to accomplish it. They need three months. I know what is in the reactor. I know everything. It was done with spectroscopy at Siena University of Padova (…) They tested the reactor without [Rossi] knew what they were doing, he continued.”

    It just seems very suspicious that from zero knowledge of LENR to a working reactor in a few months after his encounter with Rossi is possible without IP transfer.

    • BruceFast Says:

      I really hope that these early LENR pioneers don’t stifle the technology with greed and IP rights. Defkalion claims an instant-on, instant-off technology. Therefore I don’t think there’s much question that Defkalion has something that Rossi does not.

      Symeon assures me that the only real piece that Rossi gave to them was to put them onto the LENR track. He assures me that their scientists figured it out by studying the literature, of which there is plenty indexed at

      However, either the energy of the new fire will sweep along without a whole lot of legal tangles, or the courts will figure it out.

      • Brad Arnold Says:

        My prediction is that the first to market will have a tremendous advantage. Since Defkalion hasn’t licensed any LENR factories yet, it appears like they will get sloppy seconds on the LENR market.

  4. Jed Rothwell Says:

    Incite => insight

  5. Brad Arnold Says:

    Thanks Bruce. Defkalion is one of the leaders in LENR (although to my knowledge haven’t scored a patent on the technology yet). It sounds like Canada is a good base for operations, it is a shame that Greece had to be so financially unstable. Let me remind everyone that it is still a race to market, and it sounds like Leonardo is the leader, with expectations of manufacturing and selling their 1 megawatt LENR generator this month (plus a third-party verification report whose publication is imminent).

  6. AlainCo (@alain_co) Says:

    Thanks a lot Bruce for that break work in the real world.
    Defkalion position remind me the one of the Wright Brothers.
    No pet theory, analysis of pas work, and learning from the testings.

    Rossi is more strange looking, but may not be so different. From data I have he is much more rational that what he shows to us.

    thanks again

  7. briansahern Says:

    This was vaporous. Everyone wants to know where the technology is and Bruce succeeded in adding no comment.

    As a result, Defkalion gets another free pass to spend other people’s money with umpunity.

    Shameful reporting to allow them to pat you on the head and send you away feeling good about their progress. Now you should wake up a face the fact that you were treated like a child.

    • brucefast Says:

      1 – Defkalion is not spending my money. They don’t even have an option available to spend my money.

      2 – “Everyone wants to know where the technology is.” Yup. Everyone including me.

      3 – “You should wake up a [sic] face the fact that you were treated like a child.” Actually, it is you treating me like a child!

    • Iggy Dalrymple Says:

      briansahern wrote: “As a result, Defkalion gets another free pass to spend other people’s money with umpunity.”

      Mr Ahern, whose money are you spending at Ames Laboratory?

    • brucefast Says:

      Dr. Ahern, I didn’t recognize you from your handle. Just reading too fast I guess. Welcome.

      I, as the rest of us, are dying for anyone, you included, to present LENR technology to the world in an undeniable way. I am under no delusion that Defkalion has not done so.

      I wrote this report because I was in the Defkalion’s neighborhood, and decided to drop by. (I went to my niece’s wedding about 100 km away.) I had promised a report on this site, no matter what I saw, when I returned.

      As I am only one flight away from Defkalion, and as I have space available flight privileges, I am fully prepared to jump on a plane and see their technology when they have a public display ready.

      That said, despite the half dozen organizations that are hooting their horn saying that they are on the edge of a commercial product, none, including Defkalion, have produced the goods.

      I actively wait because researchers like you have promised me that LENR is real. As I believe that the technology is valid, and that it will change the world, I don’t know how to passively wait.

    • Brad Arnold Says:

      Wow – what do you want the author to do? He was polite and told us things we didn’t know before. I would love to see how you would have handled it (don’t get out much, huh?).

  8. Alan Smith Says:

    Dear Brian Ahern. Me colleagues and I have over the last 3 years developed a private research group working in LENR and related fields of endeavour.

    We would be very interested to have an update on your current work in the LENR field. I have not forgotten AR’s comment that ‘if anybody can do it, Brian Ahern can.’
    If you have posted elsewhere, and I have missed it -apologies, but if not we will provide a ready audience..

  9. Simon Derricutt Says:

    Bruce – nice report and actually I can believe that they got the data from Jed has collected a whole load of reports that tell you what hasn’t worked and what has. Again, the instant-on and instant-off is a lot different from Rossi, so adds to the evidence that Rossi just got them started down the LENR path and that they are using a different method. Belief that it is possible is important, and so this also hints that Rossi proved it to them.

    Nice that Canada gets the benefit of its more-enlightened approach to research. I’d hope that the Canadian Patent office is as enlightened.

  10. Bernie Koppenhofer Says:

    Give me a break, if Defkalion got their initial knowledge from, why don’t we have hundreds of companies introducing their reactors this month. Hundreds if not thousands of researchers were reading the same public information.

  11. Johnny English Says:

    Dr Ahern “Now you should wake up a face the fact that you were treated like a child”. Sounds like the only child throwing toys out of prams here is yourself. Perhaps you should spend more time in your lab and less time lambasting those that get off their arse

  12. Craig Binns Says:


    This is completely ridiculous. You saw nothing. Did ou see any physical object, or any working device produced by Defkalion for the market? if so, you have not told us. all you did was speak to someone who told you the company was there to exploit tax credits. As for prouction and sales, you rightly inform us that “Defkalion is selling the exclusive right to manufacture and market the Hyperion reactor (their intended 5 – 45kW reactor) to a region (country or group of countries.)” So it’s not selling magic energy machines, but “rights”. That makes it overwhelmingly probable it’s a scam. That sort of flim flam is what Rossi “sells” too. That’s what scammers sell.

    Also, you say, “LENR reaction is not a classic nuclear reaction, so it does not need to comply with the safety regulations developed for classic nuclear reactions.” Yes, Rossi said that in Florida too. But nobody can tell us what it IS, though they soon tell us what it’s NOT (ie a source of any reproducible detectable effects) when the inspectors come calling to see what the hype’s about!

    How much longer are you going to let yourself be bamboozled?

  13. Craig Binns Says:


    Why did you put the words conclusive proof, which appear nowhere in my post, within quotation marks? Yes, I already knew Defkalion had an office in Toronto, and that people work there. If they are merely selling “rights” and seeking tax credits – that is, even if they are a scam, as in the circumstances is most probable – there will be people working there. Beyond that you have learned nothing and have seen nothing.

    Iggy, is your post some sort of Zen mind game thing? My last contribution had nothing to do with conclusive proof, let alone Yankees crossing London streets. But if you go there Iggy, don’t let anyone sell you rights to buy London Bridge. Hell, don’t even buy London Bridge itself, because it has already been sold.

    • AnonyMole Says:

      When the electron spins, the Rossi top will wobble.

      Plum pudding in a nickel bowl turns the bowl to copper.

      It’s cold in Canada, fusion takes place between Eskimo noses.

      We conclude that our conclusions about conclusive proof are inconclusive.

      If my comments were to be taken as Zen’esque, I would imagine myself at peace; this despite nuclear reactions of low energy having left me feeling empty.

  14. briansahern Says:

    The article more than implies that NASA scientist, Michael Nelson was impressed. He saw no conclusive evidence and could only hope. Since that time last fall Defkalion has not generated any new data. They are selling vapor-ware justlike their teacher, Andrea Rossi.

    • Brad Arnold Says:

      I understand your skepticism, but to what end? Vapor-ware suggests no proof, and who would buy a product or technology without proof?

      • AlainCo (@alain_co) Says:

        I don’t see where are the absence of result :

        “I found everyone at Defkalion including John Hadjichristos and his lab assistants very
        cooperative with all aspects of the testing. Everything that I asked them to do was done
        without hesitation. I was allowed to bring in an independent set of thermocouples and data
        logging system to capture my own readings of the temperatures of the input and output fluid
        circuits through the Defkalion as an independent verification of their laboratory temperature
        measurements. My measurements varied from Defkalion’s temperature measurements by only
        tenths of a degree.”

        “As predicted by Defkalion, the argon (blank) run produced
        significantly less output than when charged with hydrogen. The COP was <1."

        "For the third and final day of testing, Defkalion, chose to
        trigger the hydrogen reaction much more aggressively than was done on the first day. Upon a
        preliminary look at the data, the reactor was operating well in excess of a COP of 3."

        even if as said the result are preliminary, the behavior of Defkalion is enough open, to eliminate hypothesis of fraud.

        a COP of 3 and a blank COP of <1 can eliminate the hypothesis of COP1.1…

        they give a credible explanation for the low COP (too low temperature , which is around 100, and should be around 300).
        It is coherent with latest claim of COP around 5:1 in the first day…

        the rest is not to exclude. there is only huge behavioral evidence that it works, and no reason for them to dispel doubt. It seems they have enough partners, and I confrm that currently in many place business are flirting with LENR startup, even the one who are just projects, and LENr scientis are not less assaulted by potential fiancee.

        It is rational since I know many business investment done for less evidence.

        The biggest problem with Defkalion is that they are not US based. This is the only explanation i see to such a two weight two measure syndrome.


  15. Craig Binns Says:


    We were talking about the Defkalion visit. It produced nothing.

  16. Craig Binns Says:


    That was a spambot! But anyway a Spamot could do as good a job writing about e-cats asRossi does.

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  18. Dr Bob Says:

    Hello there,

    I made a little teaser for the tests.
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    • Craig Binns Says:

      Hi Talebana

      You’re quite right! We have heard from Sterling that Obama has been on Mars. That’s when he was a CIA agent, cos the CIA have a base on Mars. They use teleportation to get there. That’s why I like it when Sterling tells me Cold Fusion is a sure thing. But I think if you can teleport people to Mars with the power of your brain, you don’t even NEED cold fusion! Anyway tell me what your opinion on this is.

  20. keefwivanef Says:

    Come on dudes……BOIL THE FOOKIN KETTLE!!!
    LENR-CANR——coming real soon, small blue planet, nobel prize, not in it for the munny……magnetic fields…..Faraday Cage….blah de blah……NEUTRONS….blah….X-Rays…….Zer Point Energy……blah de blah….40 Million Euros……blah de blah..many well respected researchers…..blah blah…..Maharishi…..blah…..Ecat Australia……blah blah Andrea Rossi…..blah Greg Watson…..blah…..SMOT ……..Blacklight Power…Blah…..Star Scientific…….blah Broullion…..blah…..send munnu……blah….psuedoskeptics……blah MaryYugo…….blah…….VOMIT.(projectile) BLEUGH ACK ACK GNRFFFFF cack cack Aaaaargh SPLOOSH!!!!

  21. keefwivanef Says:

    Oh for FUCKS SAKE!!!!!!

  22. Keef Wivaneff Says:

    Hello all you Cold Fusion nuts.
    I really enjoyed the Defkalion “demonstration” it was a HOOT!
    Matty Lewin is a scientist?
    Maybe he’s a SCIENTOLOGIST they are a bunch of froot loops just like you lot.

    Can you explain how being a “pseudosceptic” is supposed to work?

    I am sceptical about Cold Fusion because it has never been shown to produce enough heat to boil an egg.
    So, because I am alleged to be a “pseudosceptic” does that mean that I am only PRETENDING to not believe in it but that secretly I do believe in it and that’s way I’m saying I don’t believe in it so that in effect I am really supporting it?

    I don’t know about you but I’M confused :)

    • iggydalrymple Says:

      So red-hot, yellow-hot, and bordering white-hot isn’t hot enough to cook your egg? Is it a petrified dinosaur egg?

      • Keef Wivaneff Says:

        Yes GLOWING RED HOT would have been impressive IF they didn’t have any ELECTRIC HEATING ELEMENTS!
        My TOASTER gets hot and it’s not NOOCULAR.
        (btw….you are an idiot)

      • Craig Binns Says:


        My old grandmother’s electric kettle could kick the e-cat’s ass when it was plugged into the electric socket and emitting whiffs of wet steam. Maybe it was a nuclear kettle. But it couldn’t turn nickels into pennies like Rossi’s transmutation trick!

      • Keef Wivaneff Says:

        I could easily replicate Deafscallion technology.
        Just need a kettle, power cord and half a ton of bullshit.

      • Craig Binns Says:

        “Deafscallion” I like. In Ireland and N America they’re called scallions, but here in Scotland they’re “syboes”. Interesting, no?

      • iggydalrymple Says:

        Craig says “My old grandmother’s electric kettle could kick the e-cat’s ass”

        bla, bla, bla…..more Craig says. When will grandma allow a truly independent 3rd party test?

      • Craig Binns Says:


        We’d need a spiritualist medium or a ouija board to get her permission for the test, I regret to say. But to her credit, while she was alive she never sold licences to market her kettle in Japan or the USA.

  23. Dr Bob Says:

    @ who ever originally wrote this.
    “My old grandmother’s electric kettle could kick the e-cat’s ass”

    Really… your grand mother must be quite a smart lady!
    Which company is she working on?

    Personally I prefer my “off the grid” tea kettle powered by nano powders, its perfect for green tea.

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  25. art Says:

    Interesting to read this post in late 2013. Symeon left Defkalion in July, and they closed their Vancouver office with no further announcements.

    I guess the skeptics were right?

    • iggydalrymple Says:

      As best as I can recall, Jed Rothwell claims that Def stiffed him for $1,000 he claims they owe him.

    • brucefast Says:

      This is a very sad report. I just tried phoning their Vancouver office and got “the number you have reached is not in service.”

      How do we interpret this? It seems difficult for me to believe that Defkalion would have the technology that they claim, and would not be able to convince investors to give them money. Did they have bupkis all along? Were they desperately hoping to come up with something while pretending that they had it? Were they simply trying to pull a swindle? If so, why did they give me no opportunity to “invest” with them? Were they expecting Rossi to make it, and expecting to ride the wave of Rossi’s success even though they had nothing? This is not that far fetched as the floodgates of investment will be wide open once LENR makes it public.

      Could it be, however unlikely, that they had all of the technology that they claimed but that they crashed anyway? Were they just unbelievably incompetent at convincing investors? Is it harder than all that to get investors to open their wallets? Could it be that they had much of what they claimed, but were putting on a shadow show for the rest of it?

      The truth is, we’ll never know. However, Mr. Binns wins a major point on this one.

      • BobN Says:

        In my mind they must never had the goods. I find it next to impossible to believe they had the technology and could not get investors.
        This is a sad say for LENR as it sets everything back in most peoples minds.

    • Simon Derricutt Says:

      Bruce – I think they had a lot of what they said, but had problems in repeatability and thus making a manufacturable version. Like you, therefore, I’m surprised that the plug has been pulled. It could be that they going into hibernation rather than total meltdown, though, and that there is still some work being done in private. Bearing in mind the problems in Greece and Cyprus, where their money seems to have come from, it may not be a technical problem at all but a financial one.

      Yep, for now it looks like Craig was right on that one. If I ever get to Glasgow I’ll buy him a pint or two.

      • Craig Binns Says:

        Well, it’s a pity, and I take no pleasure in it. But it seemed to me from the word go that Defkalion had nothing. They were both too secretive and too bombastic about their prospects. I don’t know if they succeeded in scamming anyone of course. Were they looking from grants from the BC Provincial government? I got that impression at one time.

        Please be assured that Rossi will be next in line to put “number not in service” on his phone answering system. But if anyone does invent a magic energy machine I will be as happy as anyone else on the planet.

      • iggydalrymple Says:

        Defkalion fell off a Craiggy cliff, into the dust-Binns of time.

      • brucefast Says:

        Iggy, ,LOL!
        Craig, they had no relationship with the BC Provincial government. They had a relationship with the Canadian government through the SR&ED program. The SR&ED program is reasonably scammable, but it is seen as a crown jewel of Canadian R&D because it allows researchers to pursue rabbit trails without too painful of oversight. They expect a lot of failure, and get a lot of failure, they also get a lot of success.

      • Craig Binns Says:

        Thanks Iggy! brucefast, thanks to you also for correcting me about the potential funding source. You have noted that Defkalion didn’t appear to be soliciting investment from individuals, and they never got round to floating shares in the (by various accounts poorly-regulated) Toronto stock exchange. Do you believe that access to the Canadian government’s SR&ED programme could be valuable and unmonitored sufficiently for it to be a plausible motive for a swindler to set up a fake enterprise in Canada, if that’s what Defkalion was doing? Or is that a far-fetched idea?

  26. brian s ahern Says:

    What is this? You mention a visit to DGT and then talk about chicken pox. What happened at DGT?

    Brian Ahern

  27. briansahern Says:

    This was another mindless interview with no discussion of the technology. You noted no equipment or engineers in residence and there was no indication of where or even if they are doing anything real. Vapid interview. This was like a car commercial without showing the car. This report does you a disservice! Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2013 00:27:11 +0000 To:

  28. brucefast Says:

    Dr. Ahern,

    We learned something from this interview. We learned that Defkalion has offices in Vancouver. And we learned that you see no technology when you walk through the front door. (The interview also corrected small errors about Defkalion like the suggestion that the British Columbia government is funding them.)

    Since this interview, I had opportunity to be in Vancouver again. I asked Symeon for a chance to see his technology. He said that I could not. This lack of information is information in itself. We still know that there is no technology to be seen when we walk through the front door.

  29. Craig Binns Says:


    What reason did Symeon give for this refusal? What conclusions do you draw from it?

  30. brucefast Says:

    His reasoning was that every time they stop to demo, it detracts from their development path.

    As a technology developer, this is a reasonable concern. I suggested that, as they have demonstrated it to others recently, I would be happy to piggyback my visit on someone else’s. This also didn’t get me there.

    My firm conclusion: it is not important for them to show the technology to me. It may or may not be that it is not possible.

  31. Simon Derricutt Says:

    Bruce – I think that for anyone to show a definite public proof of something working at this time is unlikely. Such a public proof, before they are ready for mass-production, would only give the other researchers some more information to go on. I would thus expect them to stay pretty dark until they have all their ducks in a row and then to go straight into pilot production.

    I think that, as with Rossi, we can be pretty sure that they have something that works to some extent, though we don’t know what percentage of their builds work and we don’t know how long a working device will continue to function. Any predictions will be guesses, but I’d still guess that Defkalion are most likely to get to manufacturing first since they have a strong team working on it.

    No different situation at the moment – we still need to wait and see what happens.

  32. Craig Binns Says:

    You don’t believe their secretiveness is because they are running a scam and have nothing to show?

  33. keefwivanef Says:

    SCAM? did someone say SCAM?
    Too fookin right!!!
    What a mound of stinking PIGSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!

  34. iggydalrymple Says:

    Actually, I don’t know where Defkalion gained anything by their recent streaming demo. One or two viewers expressed the view that after watching the video that they could now replicate Def’s technology.

    Yes, the demo fed the curiosity of the so-called peanut gallery, but we aren’t important to the future of Def. The peanut gallery may be of importance of the future new energy because some of the audience are real experimenters, not just voyeurs.

  35. Craig Binns Says:


    Now that Defkalion has disappeared from Vancouver will we ever know whether anyone has managed to replicate their technology? Seems they can’t even replicate their own technology cos if they could, they wouldn’t have felt obliged to vanish so suddenly. Maybe they’ve all been kidnapped by Big Oil? Ever considered that possibility?

  36. briansahern Says:

    Yannis has run out of answers. Simeon quit. Nobody quits if they really had something. Nobody has been in Vancouver for six months or more. Alex has not shown up and has not designated anyone to act in his stead.

    Is Rossi next? He is better at this than DGT.

  37. iggydalrymple Says:

    “Beware of Greeks Bearing Grift.”

  38. Craig Binns Says:


    The Greeks aren’t bearing anything at all just now. I looked at the
    Defkalion website today and saw the dreaded words:

    “The site is currently under planned maintenance.”

    Oh dear me.

  39. briansahern Says:

    There is o new message. What was the intent? DGT seems to have died.

    Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 13:14:11 +0000 To:

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